too lazy to look up and not enough coffee yet

a couple of situations yesterday

1. disc lands in big patch of nasty thorn bushes on RED C (new temp hole) and they were nasty
unplayable lie ? relief ? penalty ? suck it up and throw ?

discer sucked it up and threw but incurred some damage to skin

2. Red 7 disc is right behind little tree in middle of fairway
if you throw from right behind mini full speed you will smash hand on tree
do you get 6 inches from behind mini

3. [email protected]$$ syndrome
at IN state in the second round i played with someone who made everyone in the group miserable
threw chair, kicked bag, extra drive ( i think ) on Blue 6 the long one but after every every every throw
no matter where it went , the kid whined, bi*(&ched , moaned

im sure if the kid hit an ace he would moan that someone else had one earlier and that he would have to split the money

again remember we are playing INT and its the second round - the last cards or close to last card

so the question is - yesterday if i was on his card for the second round can i call a courtesy violation on him before the round starts in front of the TD or do i have to wait for the first whine

the reason i ask is that the guys who i played with in the first round who were +7 and pretty cool got stuck with the kid in the second round and i was in the group behind them and kinda knew he was going to whine,bO&ch , and complain

i asked the guy from K-zoo and he said the kid's whining affected his and the other guys game
so back to the question - can u warn him based on prior experience or do you wait til the first whine

again we're playing INT - we know we're not good - and again im not like trying to get in his head to screw with him
im just to old to babysit especially on the course

Unless the TD has indicated casual relief is allowed from a patch of thorns, player has to play from there or take a one shot penalty and follow the options to relocate their lie in the Unplayable Lie rule.

You have up to 30cm behind your marker to place your foot (just under 12 inches). You might have been wise not to mark your disc so you could be another disc width farther behind the tree for your next throw. Forehand or reverse stance might also work to get your hand away from tree trunk.

Best option might be to tell TD of whining in first round so (s)he can talk with player before second round. It wouldn't count as an official warning but might have improved the situation in the group the second round.

This kind of behavior is prevalent in Intermediate divisions. It is up to you (and other tourney participants) to stop this type of behavior early on. Tantrums seem to be acceptable behavior in other sports (basketball, baseball, etc.) and many people come to DG from other sports backgrounds. When someone in my group flips out (I play Int) I'll talk to them off to the side after they calm down (i.e. "You need to watch your behavior... throwing your mini like that can be called for a stroke."). The next time they do it I'll issue an official warning.

BTW, when your disc is behind a tree you need to throw from that lie. Forehand or a wide backhand stances are good options here (i.e. watch how an ultimate player throws around a defender)...

thx i think ill print this out and hand it to him

I see you've mentioned a few time "We were playing INT", doesn't matter...same rules apply to all...I'm a TD, certified official and all that, and up until this year, played INT. The bag kicking, chair slamming and crap wouldn't have gone on long on my card... you've got to call people on this kind of behavior or what's the point in having rules at all.

As far as the unplayable lie penalty it is a one stroke penalty with your lie relocated up to 5 meters not closer to the target and on a line with the target so in a briar situation this often/usually means that the relocated lie would be bad too, the other option is to take a stroke penalty and play from the previous lie so it can be a very punititive penalty, that is why most discers find a way to play it from where it lies if at all possible.