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The clips from the West Virginia Open at Paw Paw are fantastic and once again feature the great camera work and professional production typically observed from Disc Golf Monthly.

However, one thing that gets annoying is the incorrect par values listed on the screen, or referred to by the announcers.

The second playoff hole (Whipping Post Hole 14, 675') is initially and correctly listed as a pro par four. During the course of the play however, one of the announcers states that it's a hole where competitors can "easily get a par 3" and after the upshot under the basket by Tony Ellis which will give him a 3, a comment is made about the "easy par for him."

The third playoff hole (Whipping Post Hole 18, 402') is wrongly listed as a par four. Everyone knows that this wide open downhill huck over a pond with a driveable green that even players who aren't elite can reach is a par 3. The announcers correctly refer to the circle 4 from Tony Ellis as a bogey but the graphical information showing "eagles" for competitors who recorded scores of deuce is completely wrong.

The fourth playoff hole (Woodshed Hole#1, 538') is initially and correctly listed as a pro par four. During the course of the play however, one of the announcers states that the hole is an "easy par 3." Later Matthew Blakely putts out for 4, which one of the announcers refers to as a "birdie." So now the hole is a par 5?

The clips from the West Virginia Open at Paw Paw are fantastic and once again feature the great camera work and professional production typically observed from Disc Golf Monthly.



Thank You.........


The third playoff hole (Whipping Post Hole 18, 402') is wrongly listed as a par four.


Actually it is a par 4, follow the link to the official tournament website
"view the course" hole 18 info link........
http://www.westvirginiaopen.com/posthole18.htm


The announcers are volunteers, I'm working on building strategies on how to get those with course knowledge and spend more time preparing themselves involved in the show. As well as give them rewards for traveling/donating their time.

Kevin-

The third playoff hole (Whipping Post Hole 18, 402') is wrongly listed as a par four.


Actually it is a par 4, follow the link to the official tournament website
"view the course" hole 18 info link........
http://www.westvirginiaopen.com/posthole18.htm



I don't think most people put too much stock in the information listed on that course section of the website, which hasn't been updated in 5+ years.

More reliable would be to ask any of the final 6 competitors what they consider that hole. Or anyone who competes in the pro division at that tournament. Or Spencer, the course designer. Or anyone involved with course design. Is a 400 ft. wide open downhill hole with an elevation drop of around 8-10 feet, effectively playing about 375 feet, which nearly all competitors drive the green (or attempt to drive the green) considered a par four? :confused:

More reliable would be to ask any of the final 8 competitors what they consider that hole. Or anyone who competes in the pro division at that tournament. Or Spencer, the course designer.



Co-TD and one of the people responsible for designing the layout, Mark Susi confirms that it is indeed a par 4

To quote Marks exact words-
"the statistics don't lie...the pros play that hole for a 3.85....therefore it's a par 4"

None of the designers there are members of the Disc Golf Course Designers group who might consider it a par 3 despite the scoring average. I wonder if the scoring average of 3.85 was adjusted for a 1000 level player group? Or is this from a blue level tee, in which case it may be a borderline par 4.

The hole is a much longer cousin of Winthrop Gold 17 which can have a scoring average over 3.5 due to OB, not due to typical good play of the hole upon which par would be based. The OB aspects need to be taken into consideration in evaluating the scoring stats. It's certainly a tough par 3 but probably a par 3, especially if the intent is for par to be set based on Gold level play. On the other hand, the designer has the ultimate authority to set par where they wish to make a hole seem to play easier or harder. Maybe their goal is for an easy par 4 to finish in the open after the Wap Wap zone?

When par in disc golf is typically defined as either scoring average or the number of full shots to the green +2, this is a prime example where par could tweaked at the discretion of the Course Designer or TD towards the latter, especially for blue and certainly for gold level play, which is what the showcase was featuring. When 5 out of 6 players take a score of "eagle" 2, it looks silly.

it is a par 3- no question whatsoever about it. mike bonday aced it in my group at wvo this year. even my weak-armed self can drive the pond and the bail-out area for those who don't attempt it is about 10 acres.

The third playoff hole (Whipping Post Hole 18, 402') is wrongly listed as a par four. Everyone knows that this wide open downhill huck over a pond with a driveable green that even players who aren't elite can reach is a par 3.



The TD and Co-TD of the 2007 WVO have spoken.
In a personal communication Mark Susi had this to say.....

"Tell Jeff if he has a problem with something...to contact us!

You (DGMtgv) have NO bearing on the pars there!


Mark"

Tournamet Director Tony Elis had this to say..........

"All the information for Pars was provided to you by us"

If there is a dispute about what par should be on whipping post 18 contact those who can change it and going forward the graphics will say that wp 18 is a par 4.