$98 for an ace or a new course record

Bunker Hill DGC (http://bunkerhilldiscgolf.blogspot.com)

$500.00 for an ACE from the WHITE tees.
$47.00 for an ACE from the BLUE tees.

Just a guess, I think we've paid out over $8,000.00 since I started keeping the ACE pot in 1991. I know I've hit it 4 times for $500.00 each plus a few smaller ones. And we all know how much Tom G. has racked up in the last year or so. :D

We cap ours at $300 on Sat. minis and $600 on Sun minis
Currently we are about $30 into our second $300 ace pot and at $30 on our Sun mini.

Well our's is nothing right now cause I hit an ace at last week's mini.

But we've had it get up to about $350 before one was hit. We plan to cap it at $500 if it ever gets that big, but so far in the last 2 years we've paid out 3 aces at $300 give or take, and one at $260 or so. Then mine...at a whooopin $49. Mostly because an ace was hit right at the time change, and Night Glow minis don't have as big of a turn out. So it just hadn't had time to get that high.

I'd trade that $49 for my next ace in a heart beat though....

Ours is currently 540.00 with no cap. We do however leave either ten or twenty percent to start the new ace pot, depending if you are a member of the local club or not.

Right now the Arlington Disc Golf Assoc is capped at $500, but once the backup ace pot reaches $250 we'll start adding to the $500 again. Once the $500 reaches $750 we'll cap it again and build the $250 up to $500. Once we have one at $750, and one at $500, we'll start a third ace pot and build it up to $250. Once we have 3 acepots, 1 at $750, 1 at $500, and 1 at $250...we'll start adding to the $750 until it gets hit. We (The ADGA) have paid some seriously HUGE ace pots in the past. One was 2300, another was 1667, another was 1582, another was 1250, i hit one for 1082, and i can't tell you how many people (i am one of those people) have hit the 750 one while the third ace pot was building to 250. The best part about it is once the BIG one is gone there's $500, plus entries, to shoot at next week while it builds to 750 again. Crazy! but FUN!

^^^ One thing that's funny about those huge vet park ace pots is how many locals seem to not be interested if it's only $500 or less. I've gone back home for a visit and asked some buddies if they plan to attend the Sunday mini and I'll occasionally hear "the ace pot's only at $500...."

Sorry to be blunt, but I think ridiculously large ace pots are a foolish waste of money that could go back into the club. Many clubs cap their ace pots at $150, keep two $150 ace pots on hand, and put all the extra money above that back into the club.

Ridiculously large ace pots generate a little buzz and get a few more people to come out to Doubles, but after it's hit, it's nothing more than a big waste of money that could be used to grow the club and the sport of disc golf. $150 is fair compensation for any ace and should generate enough draw on its own. In the grand scheme of things, does the few extra people that get pulled in for a few weeks by the $500 buzz really grow the club or the sport? Or do they disappear once the ace is hit? I'm willing to bet it's the latter.

Think of what that money could mean to the club and growing disc golf in your region. What's more important, another course in your area or lining the pockets of some player? What does more to grow the sport of disc golf? Hundreds of dollars going home with someone, or that money going directly towards funding a new course, youth series, or other club initiative? Does the club have enough money right now to buy new poleholes, sleeves, tee signs, tee box material, etc. for a new course if one is approved? Revenue streams don't just grow on trees. Most clubs are funded EXACTLY from hardcore club members and casual participants wallets. Until I see sponsors beating down our doors, I'm going to think it's foolish to just throw away $500+ for an ace.

Although it pains me (somewhat) to agree with Jeff :eek: :D , I have to say that he is spot on with his thoughts on this one.

Karl

Well said.

Shoot, I think $50, and whatever local customs impel group members to pay, and the thrill of the ace, and the extra stroke down in that day's competition, should suffice. Why should one shot be worth more than a victory?

My local course is very aceable, and only 15-20 people attend, so pots rarely climb over $100 or so. Nevertheless....for years we didn't roll the pot at all. If you aced, you won that day's pot. If not, the club got it. The club might would make several hundred dollars in a 5-month season, all of which went to good use.

Eventually, of course, the gambling bug led to rolling the pot, with a cap....to rolling the pot, with no cap. A well-timed ace might win over $100, but the club gets nothing. The theory was that it would increase attendance, which in fact has gone down as the ace pots went up.

Although it pains me (somewhat) to agree with Jeff :eek: :D , I have to say that he is spot on with his thoughts on this one.

Karl



I don't, the players all put the $1 in with the thought they can win it back with an ace. Putting into the course is a mis representation. We (SADC) collect $1 for ace pot and $1 for club/course funds. The bigger the ace pot he more players, the more money you can raise for the course. Large ace pots help the course, not hurt it.

I don't, the players all put the $1 in with the thought they can win it back with an ace. Putting into the course is a mis representation. We (SADC) collect $1 for ace pot and $1 for club/course funds. The bigger the ace pot he more players, the more money you can raise for the course. Large ace pots help the course, not hurt it.



No one is saying that you misrepresent the ace pot. You announce ahead of time that the ace pots are capped at a certain number (typically $150) and that anything above that goes back into the club. Players then know full well ahead of time what they are getting into. They have the chance to win $150, and support the club at the same time.

Big ace pots do virtually nothing to raise additional money for the course or the club. All they do is bring a few people out of the woodwork until the ace is hit, and then those folks disappear. The extra money you might bring in while those people are there until the ace is hit is MORE THAN OFFSET by the large amount of money you give away in the giant ace pot. Then afterwards, these people typically don't join the club or continue to come out for doubles, monthlies, or PDGA sanctioned events.

Big ace pots are fun. They need no further justification.

If you can justify hundreds and hundreds of dollars unnecessarily going into the pocket of a disc golfer instead of being used to help to install a new course, launch a new youth disc golf program, upgrade your exisiting course, etc. then more power to you. :)

If you can justify hundreds and hundreds of dollars unnecessarily going help to install a new course, launch a new youth disc golf program, upgrade your exisiting course, etc. Than to help a family in need or the local soup kitchen then more power to you. :)

Not exacly my personal feelings but....

Sorry to be blunt, but I think ridiculously large ace pots are a foolish waste of money that could go back into the club. Many clubs cap their ace pots at $150, keep two $150 ace pots on hand, and put all the extra money above that back into the club.

Ridiculously large ace pots generate a little buzz and get a few more people to come out to Doubles, but after it's hit, it's nothing more than a big waste of money that could be used to grow the club and the sport of disc golf. $150 is fair compensation for any ace and should generate enough draw on its own. In the grand scheme of things, does the few extra people that get pulled in for a few weeks by the $500 buzz really grow the club or the sport? Or do they disappear once the ace is hit? I'm willing to bet it's the latter.

Think of what that money could mean to the club and growing disc golf in your region. What's more important, another course in your area or lining the pockets of some player? What does more to grow the sport of disc golf? Hundreds of dollars going home with someone, or that money going directly towards funding a new course, youth series, or other club initiative? Does the club have enough money right now to buy new poleholes, sleeves, tee signs, tee box material, etc. for a new course if one is approved? Revenue streams don't just grow on trees. Most clubs are funded EXACTLY from hardcore club members and casual participants wallets. Until I see sponsors beating down our doors, I'm going to think it's foolish to just throw away $500+ for an ace.



...if you were a member of the ADGA then your voice would matter, but you're not, so it doesn't.:DWe vote on such matters, and the vote than won was $2 per player goes into the ace pot. It DOES benefit the club when it reaches a significant amount. When was the last time you showed up for a sunday mini and there was 100 players! Yep, 100+ players. That's larger than some A-tier, and larger than some NT events. The ADGA gets $1 per player, not to mention the merchandise sales.

The club has 9 brand new mach III's in it's possession(for replacements when baskets get stolen), and (as of right now) the city of Arlington has no desire for another disc golf course.

Bruce made another great point; HUGE ace pots are fun and exciting!

We play this game for fun, not to solve all the problems of the world. For that we have Obama. :D

Sounds like either a course design issue with not enough ace run holes or the quality of the players is weak. Solve either one of those issues and the "problem" of huge ace pots goes away... :p

Course design issue? I have stopped playing ace run holes alone due to aces. I have found I like long holes. I want a 500 foot duece. Yes I have a weak arm.

one problem is that most players at a league will put in a dollar or two for ace pool, 50/50 ctp, or whatever, even if the club takes a cut, IF they're getting something for to show for it. Even if that something is just a gamble.

BUT most player will not throw in an extra dollar to the club just because. So the club would get nothing with out the ace pool, as opposed to at least a little bit with it.


Anyway, the leagues i've played are usually $7: $5 to payouts, $1 ace pool, $1 to club. So both arguments are covered.

There's also those people out there who get really ticked off if ANY of their money goes to the club, and not 100% payout. We had a guy start a "Rebel Dubs" night as he called it, in which this was so, claiming it to be more fair.

Sounds like either a course design issue with not enough ace run holes or the quality of the players is weak. Solve either one of those issues and the "problem" of huge ace pots goes away... :p



Chuck, Not sure who you are replying to but if it's about VP....you're a numbers guy, do the math. How long does it take to gather $1000 when 50 players show up every sunday and give $2? :D

Let's see,
hole#2L=330' straight shot,
hole#4L=250' lefty or righty spike shot over a small tree line,
hole#5L=325' off a cliff over some oaks to a 30' green,
hole#9L=230' righty hyzer down a lane,
hole#10L=290' righty hyzer up a hill and over 2 trees to a plateau,
hole#11S=250' righty anhyzer through a tunnel that opens to a field,
hole#15L=220' righty hyzer or skip shot(most aced hole), &
hole#16L=260' righty anhyzer down a hill with ceiling(tree branch.)

The 8 holes listed also have shorter, or slightly longer pins but any position is just as aceable. Hole 6 short and hole 13 short were not included....both less than 300' impartial to either right or left handers.(rarely in the short positions though)

On any given sunday we usually have 20-30 in open and 10 of them are 980-1015 rated. Not too shabby, or weak. :p

Not talking about any ace pot in particular. Just offering tongue-in-cheek solutions. For leagues that have a history, you can also calculate the range of ace pot sizes per $1 paid in. Change the amount down to as low as $.50 toward ace and $.50 toward club/course. You might not need multiple capped pools, can have decent ace pot sizes and some players may have less objection to the literal 50/50 split to the club/course.

If you can justify hundreds and hundreds of dollars unnecessarily going help to install a new course, launch a new youth disc golf program, upgrade your exisiting course, etc. Than to help a family in need or the local soup kitchen then more power to you. :)




Surely you're trying to make a joke by extrapolating this point to an outlandish extreme.

If you're serious, then this is an extremely weak counterpoint / argument. As was alluded to by Bruce, the object is to grow the sport of disc golf, not solve the problems of the world.

I wouldn't call it a joke. Simply pointing out that you are being noble, in a way, by saying the money would serve the dg community better than the individual player. I'm taking that further, not "extrapolating this point to an outlandish extreme".
Personally, I don't show up to the mini's I play to "grow the sport" or solve the worlds problems. I show up to have a good time with an ever growing group of friends.

Personally, I don't show up to the mini's I play to "grow the sport" or solve the worlds problems. I show up to have a good time with an ever growing group of friends.



That's all fine and dandy, and I want to have a good time with an ever growing group of friends, too, but this isn't chump change we're talking about. Sponsors aren't beating down the doors of most disc golf clubs and throwing money at them, and when I see $500+ being foolishly thrown away, and I think about what the local club could do with those monies to grow the sport, it just does not make any sense whatsoever to me.

Foolishly thrown away..that is funny! How do you know what people do with their winnings? I for one am a huge fan of huge ace pots..the bigger the better!

Personally, I don't show up to the mini's I play to "grow the sport" or solve the worlds problems. I show up to have a good time with an ever growing group of friends.



That's all fine and dandy, and I want to have a good time with an ever growing group of friends, too, but this isn't chump change we're talking about. Sponsors aren't beating down the doors of most disc golf clubs and throwing money at them, and when I see $500+ being foolishly thrown away, and I think about what the local club could do with those monies to grow the sport, it just does not make any sense whatsoever to me.



Dandy and fine I am sir.
I go back to my original point. What does more to grow our sport, building courses or donating money? You scoff at the idea of donation. Is it possible that Nike and Wal-Mart would be knocking on our door if we had a notoriety of solely funding the research resulting in the cure for entitiltus?

"Dandy and fine I am sir"

~This is so true ;)

If I won $1000 ace pot I would donate the money for an additional course..... Growing the sport

Our club's minis do pretty good for the club. We aren't drawing any where near 100 players of course, but we do generate pretty good money from our minis through out the year.(the hardcore guys that show up to most every mini).

What we do is: It's $5 to play with an optional $1 ace pot. Out of that $5, $2 goes to the club, and $3 goes to the payout. So while we may eventually pay out a big ace pot. We are always bringing in money for the club with every mini. And in the 4 years I have been involved in the club and on the board, our club bank account has grown greatly.(before I was involved there was a very small bank account, and no ace pots)

And no one complains about the split, they are just happy to be hanging out with good friends playing the sport we love.(of course I am sure there are a few that are out there to win $$$...I am not one of them)

Listen here; Jeff can't help it, just agree with him. :D

i never understood the logic of capping ace pots. caps seem so arbitrary. but then again this is disc golf and a lot of our rule book also seems very arbitrary.

our weekly's (thursday night triples at druid hill in baltimore) ace pot is up to $550 and we do 50/50 payout/carryover. if someone hits it, there's always a decent payout left for the next week. fortunately, we don't have a strong need for fundraising, but we could just as easily do 50/40/10 (or something like that) for payout/carryover/fundraising.

Personally, I don't show up to the mini's I play to "grow the sport" or solve the worlds problems. I show up to have a good time with an ever growing group of friends.



That's all fine and dandy, and I want to have a good time with an ever growing group of friends, too, but this isn't chump change we're talking about. Sponsors aren't beating down the doors of most disc golf clubs and throwing money at them, and when I see $500+ being foolishly thrown away, and I think about what the local club could do with those monies to grow the sport, it just does not make any sense whatsoever to me.


You know what we'd do if the club decided to take money from our ace pool? We'd stop giving ace pool over to the club, someone independent would start taking in an ace pot every week and pay it out when its hit. We voted to have an ace pot that pays out to the golfers. It is what we want. We make over $750 per year off of our bag tags, more off of other fund raisers. We want an ace pot to hit, it works for us. It isn't a waste. It is what we chose to do with our money.

Amen brother. Jeff's views tend to be a bit awry but i guess he's entitled to at least have one. :confused:

We voted to have an ace pot that pays out to the golfers. It is what we want. We make over $750 per year off of our bag tags, more off of other fund raisers. We want an ace pot to hit, it works for us. It isn't a waste. It is what we chose to do with our money.



No one is saying "Don't have an ace pot." Where did you read that? Where are you interpreting that?

But $100-$150 is more than enough just compensation for an ace. Any money above and beyond that is money that could be used for better purposes. The fact that you raise $750 per year off of your bag tags and more off of other fund raisers is fantastic! But if you're still blowing $500+ in ace money, then your club is foolishly giving away money that could be used for better purposes: namely, to grow disc golf in your local region.

their region is one of the most developed anywhere in respect to dg. they have more courses (while not necessarily better courses) and more players and better recognition of the game/sport than anywhere between you and north carolina to the south and michigan to the west (at the very least), it appears they have known for a while what to do to grow dg in texas. you should aspire to the same "problems" in your area, i do.

I'm not focusing in on Texas or one region in particular - I am referring to large ace pots in general. I don't think we can even consider that part of the discussion - it's like comparing apples to oranges because they are in a different area of the country with nice weather year round, more land, and a hundred other factors which may greatly differ from the Mid-Atlantic. They might succeed despite giving away large ace pots just because their players don't go into a cocoon for four months like many people do in the Northeast. Or for countless other reasons.

I'm not saying that there isn't a lot to be learned from developed disc golf areas with better recognition. But in almost 15 years in this sport, I have yet to be convinced that enormous ace pots do much to grow the sport. They attract a buzz for a month or two until the ace is hit and in the end all you have is a whole lot of money that went home with some golfer that could have been used to support dozens of other more important club efforts.

Personaly I don't play many local minis that have an ace pot. Just doesn't fit my life style. I do think that Jeff_LaG has a valid point. The local scene here is growing but slowly. Funds that would benifit the course is what I would want to see. I get frustrated seeing the local club having "ace run" minis when few people participate. I mean I have seen four to five guys go out and play the short tees running at a $200 ace pot. Is that fair to the folks that built it?

Personaly I don't play many local minis that have an ace pot. Just doesn't fit my life style. I do think that Jeff_LaG has a valid point. The local scene here is growing but slowly. Funds that would benifit the course is what I would want to see. I get frustrated seeing the local club having "ace run" minis when few people participate. I mean I have seen four to five guys go out and play the short tees running at a $200 ace pot. Is that fair to the folks that built it?



We have an acepot for Tuesday night doubles. It is only for doubles, that way you don't have the Tuesday night pot wiped out by the Saturday morning tag matches.

We cap it at $150 and start building the next one. Last year with the leftover from the previous year, we had aces hit for $150, $150, $90, and $37...

We didn't cap it out of altruism for the club. We did it because the previous year when it hit $200+ without an ace, we said "wouldn't it stink to have someone hit an ace one week and then the following week you hit one for $12?" So we start building for the next ace...

Our doubles is $5: $2 to the winner, $1 for a CTP, $1 Ace, and $1 club. For the club to tax running the event any more than 20% would be unacceptable to many players. We're a small group, but we have fun...

RR has a weds ace pot at $300 with about 8 back-ups and a sunday ace pot close to $500