I have a few questions for Mr McCoy and hopefully he will appear on here to answer them :)

1) I REALLY REALLY love the league play idea. I am curious though how you think you would set-up payouts?
i would imagine unless its all cash payout regardless of division you wont catch the players you are hoping to. (you can only have so much plastic before you prefer cash.)

2) What exactly is wrong with the division set-up?
personally i think that it has less to do with the divisions and more to do with TDs and the negative stigmas attached to the lower divisions. TDs that dont offer the Noivce division are missing out on a huge portion of dgers who love to play and compete but are not good enough to place in REC even. up here in IL the IOS guys have really done a great job on maximizing the divisions.
as for the stigma, every area is going to be a different solution. i think the first step would be to re-name the REC and NOV divisions. something a bit more friendly (as in it wont have a negative stigma attached to the name already). REC has become a different division than what it was. around here it has become a very competitive field.
if you think that changing divisions again will solve sandbagging you are wrong. wasnt that what the last division re-organization was for? did it do anything in your eyes? sandbagging will always be. until the PDGA actually keeps up with "support" members (non-member) ratings it will be difficult. also, if a players rated 934 in a field that is capped at 935, is he really bagging? his rating says he should be in that division. if you think he is then your problem isnt with the divisions its with the rating system.

Mr. McCoy, if you were to be elected would a new action figure be released?

Sadly - only about 10 people left on this message board will get that. :)

There must be only 7 left, b/c I got it!

Sadly - only about 10 people left on this message board will get that. :)

I think I have that action figure picture saved on my hard drive either at work or at home, I will have to look. :D

Jeff if you have that pic let me know, I don't even have it anymore.

As for the 1st question. I believe th e. current am structure in the lower levels promotes sandbagging. I want to make the lower divisions more about a festival and make the advanced divisions as the first level if competitive play like we currently have.

My plan will have the lower divisions get paid up front with substantial players packages. Then they will play in a flight system. For example: if there are 40 players then there will be 4 flights of 10th players. The flights will be determined by their 1st 2 rounds of play. Then the last round they can be competitive with one another.

This structure is more driven toward the bigger events first.

I'm on my phone and will elaborate later when I get on a pc.

could you explain flights please? ive never really had a good explanation of what the system is.

i dont think taking away INT is a good idea. it is an extremely competitive field locally. of course all of them are, thanks to a great set of TDs in the area. i dont think that the same competitive nature would remain with the system your proposing. the top INT players would bump up to ADV for a chance at cash, but will donate more than often. and the NOV and REC players will go back to donating to those left from INT. the kind of system wont work for most. our area actually used to be sandbagger heavy several years ago, when the new division organization came out, our TDs jumped on it and i think they led the PDGA as a whole in how to do it.

Dont you think that sandbagging can be better addressed by TDs? you could through little action give TDs more rights in controlling their tournaments. Let them refuse a known sandbagger (if there truly is such a thing) to play in a division the TD knows they will dominate. When i read the TD information and services the PDGA i laughed. TDs are truly unappreciated by the current PDGA, the deserve more rights and more support from the PDGA so they can address these issues locally.
every region is different. and allowing the TDs to control their region as they and the members around them see fit. of course always following PDGA rules and guidelines.
also, what do you think of the AM Cash or Half Cash idea? you might see alot less 'bagging' in the AM fields

but that all aside, i am still more curious about the leagues. that is what i enjoy must about DG competition personally.

Let them refuse a known sandbagger (if there truly is such a thing) to play in a division the TD knows they will dominate.
They can already do that if the player is not a member. And TDs now get ratings for nonmembers who have had one in the past.

They can already do that if the player is not a member. And TDs now get ratings for nonmembers who have had one in the past.

i have heard from more than 1 TD that the 'supporting' member ratings are pretty much a joke and non-functioning. and if a non-member visits the this slow pathetic website they have to fill out a form? i have only heard/seen 1 TD mention this before. so this system only works on a voluntary basis. thats asking alot of this community in all honesty.
i meant for this to be an automatic thing the PDGA provides for TDs. those supporting members having paid a $10 fee, deserve a letter informing them of their number and informing them of what that means. also, if there are an AM and compete in 5 tournaments within the same year, they should automatically become a full member, as they have paid the $50 membership fee. that would probably generate alot more membership and show that this organization is interested in having them belong.
there are several things that need to be done to keep them here but thats a whole other issue.

i have heard from more than 1 TD that the 'supporting' member ratings are pretty much a joke and non-functioning. and if a non-member visits the this slow pathetic website they have to fill out a form? i have only heard/seen 1 TD mention this before. so this system only works on a voluntary basis. thats asking alot of this community in all honesty.
i meant for this to be an automatic thing the PDGA provides for TDs. those supporting members having paid a $10 fee, deserve a letter informing them of their number and informing them of what that means. also, if there are an AM and compete in 5 tournaments within the same year, they should automatically become a full member, as they have paid the $50 membership fee. that would probably generate alot more membership and show that this organization is interested in having them belong.
there are several things that need to be done to keep them here but thats a whole other issue.


Great ideas!

i have heard from more than 1 TD that the 'supporting' member ratings are pretty much a joke and non-functioning. and if a non-member visits the this slow pathetic website they have to fill out a form? i have only heard/seen 1 TD mention this before. so this system only works on a voluntary basis. thats asking alot of this community in all honesty.
TDs are supposed to receive the ratings of members and nonmembers in their area in their TD emailing with no effort on their part other than checking to see if the nonmembers are on the list. TDs have forms for nonmembers to fill out and can attempt to get that information so nonmembers do not have to visit the website. Of course, pre-registration by non-members also captures their information and PDGASignup is not slow.

Sadly - only about 10 people left on this message board will get that. :)

More than you think know about that. I think the original pic is still on my server.

could you explain flights please? ive never really had a good explanation of what the system is.

i dont think taking away INT is a good idea. it is an extremely competitive field locally. of course all of them are, thanks to a great set of TDs in the area. i dont think that the same competitive nature would remain with the system your proposing. the top INT players would bump up to ADV for a chance at cash, but will donate more than often. and the NOV and REC players will go back to donating to those left from INT. the kind of system wont work for most. our area actually used to be sandbagger heavy several years ago, when the new division organization came out, our TDs jumped on it and i think they led the PDGA as a whole in how to do it.

Dont you think that sandbagging can be better addressed by TDs? you could through little action give TDs more rights in controlling their tournaments. Let them refuse a known sandbagger (if there truly is such a thing) to play in a division the TD knows they will dominate. When i read the TD information and services the PDGA i laughed. TDs are truly unappreciated by the current PDGA, the deserve more rights and more support from the PDGA so they can address these issues locally.
every region is different. and allowing the TDs to control their region as they and the members around them see fit. of course always following PDGA rules and guidelines.
also, what do you think of the AM Cash or Half Cash idea? you might see alot less 'bagging' in the AM fields

but that all aside, i am still more curious about the leagues. that is what i enjoy must about DG competition personally.

A flight system will guarantee you to have very competitive nature, your actually guaranteed to be competing with others that are shooting the same score as you instead of those shooting the same score within your divisions.

Basically the Flight system will sort of just rename your current divisions

A Flight will take the place of your Adv
B Flight will be your Int
C Flight will be your Rec
D Flight will be your Novice

It will take the self declaration of your division before the tournament out of the picture and truly put you in the proper level that you are actual playing on the course.

Now first and foremost I believe AM's should get most if not all of their entry fee back up front in player packs. I don't believe in back end/post tourney payouts for Ams...paying AMs out with hundreds of dollars of merchandise after the tourney is over is making AMs plastic Professionals.

So here is the bad news. In my system your not going to be able to track your finishes on the PDGA board, instead it will be replaced with which flight you finished in, example:

Place 1st Int Division will be replaced with B Flight 1st

Here is the good news, it can also easily help to determine your skill level when you play against your local homies. If you consistently finish in the B flight then you are a B-golfer. If you consistently finish in the A Flight your an A-golfer, if your up and down in the A or B you may be an A- or a B+ ;)

More than you think know about that. I think the original pic is still on my server.

I need that pic if you have it, That was a long time ago...It went away when my original laptop crashed and sure would like to have a picture of it. Courtney has never even heard of it or seen it.

Thanks for your support big fella!!!

Mr. McCoy, if you were to be elected would a new action figure be released?


I voted for Kev for just this reason

More than you think know about that. I think the original pic is still on my server.

I know alot more KNOW about it - just not alot of them ever post on here anymore, which is the truly sad part, as this used to be a fun place to be every day.



As a TD I disagree with some of Kevin's ideas, but some others have merit and I'm curious to see what might come about from them if they ever were implemented.